Topic: Avahi sur SME

[STRyk]

Est-ce que quelqu'un à déjà réussi à faire fonctionner avahi sur SME ?
J'ai passé un temp infini à essayer de comprendre comment l'installer et le faire fonctionner mais sans succès.
Il fonctionne super bien sur unRAID mais nous sommes loin de SME/Koozali.
Pour que SME cohabite dans mon reseau ca serait parfait si toutefois je trouvais des pistes !
Merci par avance.

[Jean-Philippe Pialasse]

1 fonctionne bien sur un RAID (qui est un protocol de redondance de disque) ne veut rien dire, avahi est un service de resolution de nom….

2 pourquoi vouloir installer un système de resolution de nom sur un server sur lequel on est censé configurer toutes les ressources c’est normalement plus un service pour les machines clientes

3 dire ce que tu as fait et quelles erreurs tu rencontre serait plus efficace que de dire en d’une facon indirecte « ca marche pas »

[STRyk]

J'avais rédigé un sujet sur le problème. ici :
https://forums.contribs.org/index.php/topic,54436.msg284974.html#msg284974

Depuis ce temps, j'avais tenté des tas de choses régulièrement sans jamais m'en sortir.
Je n'ai pas posté car ca n'apporterai pas grand chose.

Récement, en résumé, j'ai utilisé ceci pour télécharger puis installer les packages :

# yum install --downloadonly --downloaddir=SME_v9.2.0_Avahi-full --enablerepo=smecontribs avahi avahi-tools avahi-ui-tools avahi-utils

J'ai tenté des tas de packages en plus mais je ne vois pas ce qui doit être primordial.

J'avais préparé une réponse au sujet du 26 mars mais au vue de la réponse, ça 'a bien découragé.

En gros :
L'idée vient du fait que j'ai monté une machine avec SME chez un ami qui n'y connait pas grand chose, mais "bidouille" tout de même, sans trop connaitre linux. Le commun des mortels comme nous tous... Voulant un NAS pour sauvegarder ses données et ayant un ancien PC de coté, je lui proposé d'installer et configurer SME. Surtout qu'il n'a pas la possibilité de travailelr et de dépenser une fortune pour ca. le disque de 1To suffira, un second de recyclage sera ajouté pour faire du RAID1 et maintenant j'en ai un à lui donner.
Effectivement pour s'amuser, je me suis bien amusé, il m'a posé plein de questions "X ou Y", parfois farfelues mais ca fait partie d'une ignorance de tout ces systèmes bien organisé que sont OMV, SME et unRAID dont l'utilisateur final n'est pas forcément obligé de mettre lesmains dans le cambouis. C'est bien le but d'un tel système ?.
Il utilise un ordinateur portable Apple de 2005 et il m'a fait voir chez un autre ami ne connaissant encore moins linux, que Linux "unRAID" permettait d'ajouter "bonjour", que le système était "super simple"...
Chose importante surtout : la possibilité de faire passer Linux pour un volume "Time Machine". Ce qui motive mon copain, car l'outil est intéressant pour les sauvegarde Apple. Entre autre leserver passe pour un server Apple.
J'ai donc cherché ce qui faisait cette dfférence avec SME et je me suis rendu compte que c'était Avahi et qu'il était assez utilisé dans le monde Linux. J'étais donc étonné que je n'en ai jamais entendu parlé sur SME. En regardant sur le DVD d'installation j'ai trouvé ceci, les fichier issus du CD d'installation de SME 9.2 :
avahi-autoipd-0.6.25-17.el6.x86_64.rpm
avahi-glib-0.6.25-17.el6.x86_64.rpm
avahi-libs-0.6.25-17.el6.x86_64.rpm

Sans Avahi, depuis un mac voici comment est "traité" SME/Koozali, comme un vulgaire PC

Avec Avahi, suivant le réglage il sera "découvert" comme une machine "Bonjour/Rendez-Vous", comme un Mac.

Concernant la configuration, Avahi utilise et nécessite plusieurs choses, comme "mDNS/DNS", donc j'ai navigué dans plusiurs fichirs de "conf" sans réussir à m'en sortir. Le Mac voit toujours SME comme un PC.

Je me pose donc plei nde questions sans avancer : Comment s'assurer si mDNS/DNS-SD est bien activé et comment bien configurer la chose dans Koozali 9.2 ?

Voilà...

Merci pour m'avoir lu Jean-Philippe.

Et merci à ceux qui ferait avancer la chose pour tout les utilisateur de MacOS, car SME est une très belle distribution mais quasi inconnue des utilisateurs lambda.

[Jean-Philippe Pialasse]

nous étions donc dans le cas d’un cas XY

ton besoin est un service bonjour


installe la contrib wsdd https://wiki.koozali.org/Wsdd


tu auras besoin certainement d’attendre un peu que le service reconnaisse le reseau et probablement de redémarrer les clients.

[STRyk]

Merci, j'ai essayé mais :

# yum install smeserver-wsdd --enablerepo=smecontribs
...
Aucun paquet smeserver-wsdd disponible.
Erreur : Rien à faire

GLoups !

[STRyk]

J'ai beau essayer de retourner le problèem dans tout les sens je ne comprends pas comment m'en sortir.
Avahi n'est pas la solution ?

[ReetP]

chose dans Koozali 9.2

v9.x is no longer supported.

Upgrade to v10 where you will find smeserver-wsdd.

[STRyk]

Mais je ne suis pas sur 10.
J'aimerai que celà fonctionne sur 9.2 et ensuite j'apprendrais avec 10.

J'ai testé et installé "smeserver-wsdd" sur 10 mais je ne sais pas à quoi celà correspond.
Mon Mac ne voit pas le server koozali 10, ni le PC de toute façon.

# systemctl status wsdd
● wsdd.service - Web Services Dynamic Discovery host daemon
   Loaded: loaded (/usr/lib/systemd/system/wsdd.service; enabled; vendor preset: enabled)
  Drop-In: /usr/lib/systemd/system/wsdd.service.d
           └─50-koozali.conf
   Active: active (running) since dim. 2021-08-01 18:46:27 CEST; 9min ago
     Docs: man:wsdd(1)
 Main PID: 1810 (python3)
   CGroup: /system.slice/wsdd.service
           └─1810 python3 /usr/bin/wsdd -4 -i enp0s5 -w workgroup -s

Je ne comprends pas ce que c'est que ce "wsdd".

[ReetP]

Mais je ne suis pas sur 10.
J'aimerai que celà fonctionne sur 9.2 et ensuite j'apprendrais avec 10.

Too late. You should have been testing while we developed and been ready. You have had a couple of years to practice and learn.

v9.x is no longer supported, so unless it is a question on upgrading to v10, please do not ask.

Next please read to understand the issue you are facing.

Je ne comprends pas ce que c'est que ce "wsdd".

Why did you install something you did not understand?

There is plenty of info on wsdd and what it does. Read here and the wiki.

You can probably install avahi on v10 - have a search for "centos 7 avahi" - but not sure many have 2005 Macs that need support. You'll have to work out how to add services under v10. But that isn't for beginners.

Yes, Koozali SME is simple to install and use in 99% of cases.

But. We can't support all old and EOL hardware & software.

Your 2005 laptop is out of support, is probably insecure, and probably won't support modern protocols, so even if you install Avahi the Mac may not be able to connect. Time to move on.

[STRyk]

Too late. You should have been testing while we developed and been ready. You have had a couple of years to practice and learn.

v9.x is no longer supported, so unless it is a question on upgrading to v10, please do not ask.

Next please read to understand the issue you are facing.

Cool.

Why did you install something you did not understand?

C'est de l'humour ?

Yes, Koozali SME is simple to install and use in 99% of cases.

But. We can't support all old and EOL hardware & software.

Your 2005 laptop is out of support, is probably insecure, and probably won't support modern protocols, so even if you install Avahi the Mac may not be able to connect. Time to move on.

Est-ce de l'humour une nouvelle fois ?
Dois-je aussi tuer mes grand parents car ils sont obsolètes ?
Dois-je jeter tout mon matériel informatique aussi ?
Sincèrement...
A moins que vous puissiez me payer les derniers ordinateurs du moment, pourquoi pas.
Mais il y a une réalité.
A moins d'être dans les étoiles...

Je suis effaré de lire ce genre de choses. 

[ReetP]

Why did you install something you did not understand?

C'est de l'humour ?

Despite having a really wicked sense of humour, I tend to find it doesn't really help when debugging stuff. Facts, reading a lot, and methodology help.

Install code you do not understand on a machine that doesn't matter - you can play and learn to your hearts content.

Sysadmins do not do that on production machines as it is likely to break them and then you will be asking how to fix your obsolete broken server.

Is this humor again?

See above

Should I also kill my grandparents because they are obsolete?

Irrelevant to the point in hand. It is a logical fallacy.

Should I throw away all my computer equipment too?

Do you still live in a cave?
Do you drive a traction engine to work?
Do you use a portable phone from 2005?
Do you you use punch cards?

What other old devices do you expect us (and RHEL) to support?

Sincerely ...
Unless you can afford me the latest computers, why not.
But there is a reality.
Unless you're in the stars ...

Seriously, you have had 16 years to save for a new one. Even a newer, not obsolete, secondhand one. And note - most of all my kit is secondhand because *I* can't afford lots of new stuff. I just make sure it is not EOL. You can pick up mountains of cheap second hand gear on ebay or recyclers.

Your 2005 machine will probably not support modern encryption protocols any more than DOS will. And that is where you will struggle for connectivity in 2021. And leave yourself open to being hacked.

Despite what you think, I am not trying to be unkind here. We have seen the same sort of questions asked for years.

I am trying to save you from wasting a lot our time trying to debug something that you don't understand, that none of us use, and that quite possibly will not work on server code that is EOL.

I hope that it will save some of your time too.

[STRyk]

Qui vous dit que c'est sur une machine de "production"...
Qui vous dit que ces machines sont sur "internet" ?
Vos arguments sur les choses obsolètes ne sont pas le sujet et quand bien même on s'en fiche complètement.
Des personnes font de belles choses avec simplement un couteau. Merci pour les arguments mais ça suffit, vous vous epuisez pour rien à devoir imaginer plein de choses.
J'ai plein d'argument mais ca ne fera pas avancer le problème.
Bien sûr on pourrait tout jeter, mais on ne ferait plus rien. L'argent n'est pas tout, l'argent manque à beaucoups...
J'en ai marre de lutter contre des moulins.
Tant pis pour ce sujet. A clore. Autant mourir.
Merci tout de même.

[ReetP]

Thanks for those kind words.

I'm trying to be constructive.

Please upgrade to v10.

Please supported equipment.

Regards.

[STRyk]

I also tried version 10 and then?
With 10, none of my machines see Koozali ...
Let us die little by little it will be easier.

[ReetP]

I also tried version 10 and then?
With 10, none of my machines see Koozali ...

I have already said that now is not the time to be learning about v10 - you have had a couple of years to practice and learn - see the threads on the subject here.

And then desktop your machines are also obsolete, and probably don't understand modern secure protocols as already explained. They might be able to handle SMB3, but you haven't even told us what version of the OS you are using so it is impossible to answer anything.

We are also not going to turn the clock back. Partly because RedHat won't, and then even if they did, we don't want to be supporting insecure and hackable protocols.

No, even I baulk at the many 'advances' in technology. But not on security. We have to move on.

Let us die little by little it will be easier.

Please leave the dramatics to Shakespeare, and just stick to the facts.

If you have any further questions on v10 and supported desktop OSs then please ask. If not then you are on your won.

Thanks.

[STRyk]

Nous n'avancerons pas car demain il y aura encore autre chose et encore demain.

C'est incohérent de lâcher les "anciens" car la réalité c'est qu'ils existent encore.

J'efface Koozali 10.
Merci tout de même.

[STRyk]

1 fonctionne bien sur un RAID (qui est un protocol de redondance de disque) ne veut rien dire, avahi est un service de resolution de nom….

Je viens seulement de comprendre que tu n'a pas compris mon texte car je parlais de "Linux unRAID" : https://unraid.net/
 
J'aimerai bien comprendre comment faire fonctionner Avahi sur SME 9.2 pour les anciennes machines.
Mais je passe des heures et je tourne en rond. Je ne vois toujours pas pourquoi ca ne marche pas alors que sur unRAID c'est très bien implanté et fonctionne simplement.

[ReetP]

I would like to understand how to make Avahi work on SME 9.2 for old machines.
But I spend hours and go around in circles.

Yup - and wasting your time on an unsupported operating system to cater for an ancient unsupported machine with an unsupported OS. No one here is going to help you with it for reasons we have already explained. Please stop asking or the topic will be locked.

I still don't see why it doesn't work when on unRAID it is very well established and just works.

Because Unraid is a "paid" system and has full time developers who have decided to implement it.

We are part time, not paid, and none of us have any use for Avahi on v10 and therefore no inclination to implement it. We have more urgent things to do. Personally I am still working on Affa, PHPKi, Ipsec VPN and some other stuff because I need them myself, and others need them too.

You have a few options.

Do it yourself on v9. You are on your own. Don't ask any more questions about it please.
Do it yourself on v10 as a contribution. You may get some assistance with your code, but no one is going to write it for you.
Pay someone else to write it for you.
Open a New Feature Request and if anyone here ever has any time or inclination they may one day look at it in the future. but it is unlikely.

For a starter on v10 you can read this:

https://www.poftut.com/linux-avahi-daemon-tutorial-examples/

You would probably need these from 'base' repo' at a minimum:

avahi
avahi-tools

You then need to work how to:

Create a Koozali config entry including status, TCP/UDP port access etc e.g. stuff like this, though it needs more:

Code: [Select]

config set avahi-daemon service status enabled TCPPort 5353 UDPPort 5353 access public
signal-event remoteaccess-update
systemctl restart avahi-daemon.service
systemctl status -l avahi-daemon.socket avahi-daemon.service

(restart gets basic Avahi about up and running - I could see the server for a while in Finder on this Mac but it has gone again as it was a swift hack. Beyond that, good luck)

Create a new Koozali systemd service to run the service properly - see wiki - it needs modifying from the web page above
Understand what needs to go in the configuration files
Template your configuration files
How to automatically populate the configuration files when the system is updated so it works with other Koozali services - they have to work together or things like DNS will break.
Create config files to advertise services. Work out how to get file shares working with something like afp to support ancient unsupported bricks.

You need to read some of these and realise you will also need netatalk/afp for older machines as modern ones use SMB2+ and that makes this all irrelevant for modern machinery. You will probably have to build your own RPMS for that.

https://wiki.centos.org/TipsAndTricks/UsingNetatalk

https://jsherz.com/avahi/service/mdns/cifs/smb/afp/media-server/2015/11/16/avahi-file-share-discovery.html

https://kremalicious.com/ubuntu-as-mac-file-server-and-time-machine-volume

This article is very old and has been rendered obsolete for OS X 10.9 Mavericks and above. Apple uses v2 of the Samba protocol, dubbed SMB2 for file sharing by default now, which includes many technical advantages over AFP. On Ubuntu, the Samba package can be easily installed and configured to provide connectivity between Ubuntu und Mac OS X out of the box.

You should follow the steps in the following article only if you want to setup a Mac with an OS X version below 10.9. or you are absolutely sure you want to use AFP for file sharing.

So you will then need to work out how to advertise and allow secure access to the file shares. This is absolutely a non trivial, time consuming, and therefore expensive set of tasks.

I am one of the only devs here with a Mac, and I have zero experience or interest in Avahi/Netatalk..... I can use SMB and that is all that is required for me to work.

I've given you as much help and time as I can afford. This is a really complicated subject, hence you are struggling, and it will be cheaper and easier to just go buy a newer machine. But the beauty of open source is that the choice is yours.

Finally, please don't ask about v9.x again. If you have specific code or technical queries on v10 that are not answered in the wiki then please ask.

Good luck with your endeavours.

[Jean-Philippe Pialasse]

dire cela fonctionne sur une distribution basée sur slackware sans plus d’info sur la version n’est pas tres pertinent.
C’est comme dire que le nouveau Flight Simulator ne marche pas sur MacOs 11 alors qu’il marche sur windows.

Encore une fois nous ne pouvons que t’inviter à comprendre le protocol plutôt que d’installer au hasard et espérer que cela marche.

entre autre tu as besoin de comprendre comment marche un réseau, à quoi sert un firewall, et comment le configurer pour des besoins spécifiques.

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/20986671/could-i-use-avahi-to-publish-service-across-subnetworks

[STRyk]

Ne prenez pas tout au pied de la lettre, je compare simplement avec ce qui marche autre part.
unRAID c'est un linux comme tout les autres. Pour Avahi, il y a des tas de tuto qui marche (sans doute) mais avec certaines version sur certains linux dans certaines conditions.
Donc on est obligé de "bidouiller", personne n'a un bac +12 en informatique, sinon les forums n'existeraient pas.
J'en profite encore une fois pour remercier ceux qui prennent du temps pour les gueux.

En tout cas, je compare avec d'autres OS car Avahi fonctionne sur d'autres linux et c'est dommage que SME n'ai pas Avahi car c'est très léger et aide bien pour les Mac.
depuis le passage à SME 10 je glisse tout doucement sur unRAID en utilisant SME 9.2.0 en VM pour ce que j'ai pu monter depuis toutes ces années.
Dans peu de temps il ne sera plus en VM. Dommage.

Je me suis fait rembarré car je n'étais pas présent lors des beta de SME10... Bon, ok mais je n'ai pas les compétences ni le temps et je ne joue pas à peter plus haut que j'ai les fesses, je connais mes limites.
Donc du coups ca ne me motive plus du tout à rester sur SME. C'est bien dommage mais de toute façon j'ai l'impression que ca meurt tout seul.
C'est bien dommage...

[ReetP]

OK, so you have been told this before.

First you wanted to install this on v9 (but you didn't tell us that despite there being warnings in the forums abitu no support for v9 apart from upgrade issues). We are not going to help you add software to an unsupported operating system in an attempt to support an unsupported Mac OS.

On top of which we are not going to try and install it on v10 because it will be a large amount of work for which we do not have time or inclination as none of us have your hardware to test, and none of have any need because v10 supports all modern Macs including this Macbook Pro M1 that I am using to type this.

So yes, if you feel inclined then try and make it work - I spent some considerable amount of my time outlining some steps above for you. This is open source. The rest is up to you.

If you think that you can install Avahi on v10 with a few 'tweaks'  go right ahead and show us. We'll happily accept your contribution.

Note that unRaid has professional paid devs and the luxury to do what ever they want. This NOT a trivial exercise.

There is a price for their time and expertise..... Has your trial expired?

https://unraid.net/pricing

I got rebuffed because I was not present during the SME10 beta ... 

No - you have not been rebuffed because you weren't using the beta (though your continual complaining that 'others' haven't fixed your issues are tedious). You have been told it is because we are not going to to help you install software on an unsupported OS FOR an unsupported OS, and none of us have any interest in doing it on v10. If you want it, do it yourself. Or pay someone to do it for you. The fact that you couldn't be bothered to help with v10 is just icing on the cake.

Like your other comment in the forums just now about systemd being hard to learn. It's ugly but not impossible. But it has been around for years. Is it our fault if you haven't bothered to try and learn about it? Youhave had plenty of time, the same as you have had with v10.

Note. We build Koozali SME because we want to, not because we have to. If you want something to happen then do what we did and stop moaning and start learning. No one here owes you anything.The code is open source for you to take and do whatever you like with it. That license does not include any obligation on our part to do anything at all.

Well, ok but I don't have the skills or the time and I don't play fart higher than my butt, I know my limits.

You don't have the skills. Is that suddenly our problem? Your continual rudeness because we won't drop everything and fix your issues does nothing but alienate us.

What makes you think that WE have time? What makes you think that we have the skills or knowledge to do this? Personally I have no clue about Avahi and I am not sure any of the others contributors here do. I did some research to try and help you and posted that above, but that still isn't enough to stop you complaining.

You have been told that our free time is dictated by our jobs, our wives, our children, friends and family. It is also directed to help people who have more sense, and more manners, which you seem to be sadly lacking.

You have also been told that if you carry on this topic will be locked. So it is.

Please think long and hard about how you speak to the very people you want to help you, bearing in mind that they are unpaid and do this in their spare time.

If you are going to be rude anywhere else in the forums your account will be moderated.

Thank you.