Koozali.org formerly Contribs.org

RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board

RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« on: November 17, 2017, 01:07:05 AM »
RequestedDeletion(RequestedDeletion) wishes to be nominated as President of the Board and feels he wasn't given the opportunity to be nominated (see devinfo mailing list)

Vote "YES" here if you want to nominate RequestedDeletion to the Board of Directors
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Greg J. Zartman
LEI Engineering & Surveying

SME user and community member since 2000.

Offline ReetP

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2017, 01:44:37 AM »
Just for clarity, as per Board rules, he has to first be elected to the Board from which he resigned a few months back, and then voted in as President by the other Board members.

Straightforward, simple and democratic.
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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2017, 01:48:29 AM »
Just for clarity, as per Board rules, he has to first be elected to the Board from which he resigned a few months back, and then voted in as President by the other Board members.

Straightforward, simple and democratic.


He didn't resign just once.  He's resigned and then demanded to be back on the board 3 times.   
----
Greg J. Zartman
LEI Engineering & Surveying

SME user and community member since 2000.

Offline janet

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2017, 03:41:13 AM »
He didn't resign just once.  He's resigned and then demanded to be back on the board 3 times.

Sounds like RequestedDeletion is creating a bad track record for himself, 3 times over.
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Offline stephdl

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2017, 12:19:18 PM »
vote no
See http://wiki.contribs.org/Koozali_Foundation
irc : Freenode #sme_server #sme-fr

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Offline byte

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2017, 01:00:14 PM »
vote oh dear no!
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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2017, 03:23:37 PM »
I vote no against this nomination.

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2017, 06:16:50 PM »
Vote:  NO
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Greg J. Zartman
LEI Engineering & Surveying

SME user and community member since 2000.

Offline DanB35

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2017, 09:04:41 PM »
I'd suggest that this topic is premature.  If he wants to be considered as a candidate, RequestedDeletion knows how to come here and start a topic nominating himself.  When he does so, hopefully he'll explain why he wants to be back on the board from which he most recently resigned less than three weeks ago.
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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2017, 09:42:42 PM »
VOTE NO !!!!!!

Offline janet

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2017, 09:11:21 AM »
I'd suggest that this topic is premature.......

Premature maybe, but in some ways this nomination (if that is what it is called) is too late. Voting has already started for Nominated persons. I know of no other voting system in the world where nominations are still happening after voting has commenced. Is this situation catered for in the constitution or rules ?
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Offline DanB35

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2017, 12:56:32 PM »
Premature maybe, but in some ways this nomination (if that is what it is called) is too late. Voting has already started for Nominated persons.
From this post:
https://forums.contribs.org/index.php/topic,53399.0.html
Quote
If you wish to stand for election yourself then please start a new post with a title of "Nominee - Your Name" and write a little about who you are and why you should be elected.
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Offline Jean-Philippe Pialasse

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2017, 12:17:56 AM »
Janet, indeed this is pretty unusual. but I took what have been done in the the next years as rule.

It may need changes for the next years : one period to call for candidates. on periode for vote.

DanB35,
I would say, it make sens to say this thread is premature as this was not initiated by RequestedDeletion, who knows what to do.

I would suggest to move this thread to a moderation archive or closing it. This would however need a board decision as this notted in the election post.

Offline janet

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2017, 10:46:17 PM »
OK, I reviewed all the threads & words recently written about elections & RequestedDeletion (RequestedDeletion), & here are my conclusions.
RequestedDeletion (RequestedDeletion) has been nominated here, he has had ample opportunity to comment & state his reasons for wanting to be on the Board (with potential to be appointed as President by the Board), & also to tell us his qualifications, experience & what he can bring to the job or do for SME/Koozali server.
We hear very little from him except claims of takeovers by certain persons etc.
It seems everything has been done by the rule book, the current Board has discretion to propose those interested to serve on the new Board for election or re-election.
At the time this process started, RequestedDeletion (RequestedDeletion) had resigned from the board thus indicating he did not want to run for re-election.
He indicated a short time later he did want to run for election to the Board.
Greg Zartman has nominated him in this thread & the Board has discretion to re-examine the votes as they see fit should it prove necessary.
To be fair to RequestedDeletion (RequestedDeletion), I am aware he does a lot of work behind the scenes on the Wiki etc, so does make a valuable contribution in that way.
It seems though his erratic comittment and/or attitude to the Board is more problematic & creates instability rather than stability.

It is really up to the members to have their say & vote for or against his nomination & if nominated for consideration to the Board.


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Offline janet

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2017, 10:46:54 PM »
VOTE NO
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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2017, 12:51:54 AM »
I don't want to start a big flame war here, but wanted to add some clarifying comments.

I created this thread because HSF made the accusation on the devinfo mailing list that there was some kind of conspiracy to take over the SME Server project here:

https://lists.contribs.org/pipermail/devinfo/2017-November/014143.html
https://lists.contribs.org/pipermail/devinfo/2017-November/014145.html
https://lists.contribs.org/pipermail/devinfo/2017-November/014146.html


HSF went on to say he wanted to be board president here:

https://lists.contribs.org/pipermail/devinfo/2017-November/014148.html


This is FAR from the first time HSF has made acquisitions like this or attempted to derail the leadership of this project, discourage, and cut down.  Many good people have left this project because of actions just like this one. 

Those who have been working hard to keep this project afloat such as JPP, Dan, and several others don't deserve this kind of attack.  What they do is a thankless job.  They put in countless hours of their own time and literally get nothing in return for it.  Nobody else is stepping up to do the work they are doing.  They are holding this project together, so we own them nothing but a huge thank you.

This thread needs to remain: 1) To put to bed any notion that the current volunteer leaders are somehow preventing others from participating in leadership.  2) As a reminder to HSF of the harm comments like the ones made last week cause.

« Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 01:17:45 AM by gzartman »
----
Greg J. Zartman
LEI Engineering & Surveying

SME user and community member since 2000.

Offline TerryF

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2017, 06:54:17 AM »
On the money..
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Offline kankan

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2017, 12:53:12 AM »
VOTE NO

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2017, 07:20:02 PM »
Vote no.

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #19 on: November 21, 2017, 11:36:09 PM »
Vote No.
Jim

guest22

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2017, 09:54:46 PM »
I won't go into details, but I never asked for this posting and comments. I asked HOW the election process works for individuals and HOW to nominate. Not if somebody wants to do it for me with all kinds of remarks and follow up remarks.

I kindly request these postings to be removed. I did not nominate myself, nor was I given instructions nor the opportunity.

Offline DanB35

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2017, 11:14:29 PM »
I did not nominate myself, nor was I given instructions nor the opportunity.
Your email of 16 November to the devinfo list said you wanted to be president, which certainly sounds like you were trying to nominate yourself.  You were given instructions on at least three occasions on how to properly nominate yourself, and thus you had (and still have) the opportunity to do so.  What you choose to do is, of course, up to you, but I don't expect this topic to be removed.
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guest22

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2017, 11:35:38 PM »
If I want to I nominate myself on my own behalf with my own motivations. Again, please remove this topic.

Offline DanB35

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2017, 11:43:33 PM »
Not my call, but I don't think it should be removed.  You made the (ridiculous) accusations in a public forum, along with the demand that you be considered for the board.  This topic is a response to that demand.  You don't get to dictate what other people say about you, and you don't get to rewrite the history of your behavior.
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guest22

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2017, 12:26:11 AM »
Sorry, but I did not 'demand' anything but merely expressed my intention that I want to become something. No demands, just asking for the proper way. I did made any accusations, I mentioned POSSIBLE election fraud as I mentioned many things before when I was on the board. Those questions and my expressions of concerns were ignored too.

I am now asking for the 3rd and last time, please remove this post.




Offline ReetP

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2017, 01:16:48 AM »
Those questions

.....to which you already knew the answers (unless during your tenure as a board member you couldn't be bothered to read the rules)

Quote
and my expressions of concerns were ignored too.

Because they were baseless, without foundation, and a slur on the volunteer people trying to do some good work here.

Which you already know.

Quote
I am now asking for the 3rd and last time, please remove this post.

Sounds like a demand here. 'and last time'.

Or what, exactly ?

It is a matter of public record. Along with a lot of your other outbursts. If you can't handle what has been said then you ought to have thought twice before you posted in the first place.

You created this mess with your continual bitching and haranguing, of which we have all had a stomach full, and which has cost us more devs and users than I care to count. People are sick to the back teeth with your continual outbursts, stirring up problems and arguing for no valid reason, usually followed by periods of silence, and then springing back as if nothing had ever happened and you hadn't offended anyone.

Previously people just shut up (and or more usually left) and let you simmer down. For once they are telling you like it is. You were the one that started it. You reap what you sow.

I have said many times that you have a huge talent, and have defended you many times in the past (believe it or believe it not) but all that good that you do is completely lost by moments like this. Quite frankly we are better off without you. For all your good, you have cost SME far too much. You would have been banned on most other forums. You haven't been here purposefully so that you can't accuse people of 'silencing democracy' or 'censorship' whatever other verbiage you throw up.
 
May this thread serve as a reminder to you. I'd pin it permanently, and personally I'd like to frame it and stick it on the front of the wiki as a reminder how destructive one person can be. And when you have calmed down, your temper tantrum is over, and you've picked up all your toys again, you can come back and remind yourself why this thread ever occurred.

You own it, outright.
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guest22

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #26 on: November 24, 2017, 02:09:24 AM »
Wow, you guys are really making an effort of this blaming game. I've been sticking my neck out since 2003 and have always supported SME Server. If there is something you would like to discuss you could have contacted me or discuss it during board meetings. Unfortunately there are no meeting notes of those, despite me asking a zillion times.



As a board member one is responsible in person for any (financial) actions taken by the non profit incorporation. In that role I have been asking many questions, but I was waved away and 'hushed'. Exactly as happens here now.


The Koozali Foundation Inc. bylaws is one thing. US law and responsibility as individual board member (also in case of mis management) overrules any bylaws. Each individual board member is personally responsible.


Hence my request for transparency as a board member but was never given, hence me leaving the board. For there is NO financial report/transparency/accountability whatsoever.


Maybe you donation has been taken for some other purposes. I really can't say due to the lack of any overview/transparency at all, for over 2 years. In case of any fraud, each individual board member can be held subject to criminal investigations in the US and beyond. Say good bye to you travels.


Paranoid? No, simply pragmatic and simply asking transparency and openness. Never got it.


https://www.doj.state.or.us/charitable-activities/laws-guides-for-charities/your-rights-roles-and-responsibilities-as-a-nonprofit-officer/


https://www.doj.state.or.us/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/guide-nonprofit-board-service.pdf


amongst other things, e.g. this is what I have been asking for but never were given:


"In order to carry out your legal responsibilities as a board member, you must be able to make informed judgments about important matters regarding the organization and operations of the charity. The law permits you to reasonably rely on information from the charity’s staff, its lawyer, its accountant, outside advisors, and board committees in making those judgments. Your right to information includes the following: you have the right to reasonable access to management, to have reasonable access to internal information of the organization and to the organization’s principal advisors, such as its auditors and lawyers. Senior management must also be willing to facilitate board access to books and records of the charity. The board has the right, if necessary, to engage the services of outside advisors at the charity’s expense to assist it with a particular matter."

Since the Koozali board has no procedure or does not even know how to organize itself as a state of Oregon non profit, I have to report to the state of Oregon why I am no longer member of the board of directors. For I am one of the founding directors, but was never given any prove the administration and or membership was adjusted officially.

Next time I travel to the US, I would like it NOT to be hold for questioning/detained or expelled due to my role as board member of a non compliant or even a possible fraudulent board of a US non profit.

That would severely damage my job opportunities, just like this unlawful post for it does not adhere to the bylaws. Hence my 3 requests for it to be removed.

Offline ReetP

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2017, 02:55:32 AM »
Wow, you guys are really making an effort of this blaming game.

I'm afraid you started it. I'm just stating facts so people are in no doubt that you are talking nonsense, as ever.

Quote
I've been sticking my neck out since 2003 and have always supported SME Server. If there is something you would like to discuss you could have contacted me or discuss it during board meetings. Unfortunately there are no meeting notes of those, despite me asking a zillion times.

Pardon ? What are you rambling about now ? You started off on Election fraud. Where are you headed now ?

You've been sticking your oar IN since 2003, that IS for sure.

Contact you to discuss what ? You have been told of your destructive nature on numerous occasions via numerous methods. You know that full well, and if I could be bothered I'm sure I could find you a few reminders.

Quote
As a board member one is responsible in person for any (financial) actions taken by the non profit incorporation. In that role I have been asking many questions, but I was waved away and 'hushed'. Exactly as happens here now.

Blah blah

Maybe you donation has been taken for some other purposes. I really can't say due to the lack of any overview/transparency at all, for over 2 years. In case of any fraud, each individual board member can be held subject to criminal investigations in the US and beyond. Say good bye to you travels.

Paranoid? No, simply pragmatic and simply asking transparency and openness. Never got it.


Ahhh so now you change the goalposts again. Another toy leaves the pram. Will you never learn?

Accusing people (and that would include me) of defrauding Koozali? That is a pretty serious allegation you are making there. Just enough to try and cast doubt, but trying very hard to make yourself look innocent 'I was just asking, it wasn't an accusation'.

Actually, yes it is.

I know that whilst I was on the Board every single penny was accounted for. Quite frankly there wasn't enough cash in the pot to do anything much anyways. So I have no fear about travelling.

As far as I am aware, the last I heard was that donations were up a bit and there was a bit more cash in the bank (I think there is a missive from JPP on the subject). But we are talking a few thousands of dollars here - hardly worth the effort of defrauding, and you have had a good idea about the value of those figures for a long time, whether you have seen accounts or not.

Trying to accuse people here of financial fraud is illogical and pathetic, and I suggest you think very hard about retracting your comment before someone takes it personally, and seriously.

I'm not biblical, but I always like this quote. Have a good think about it.

"So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her."
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guest22

Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #28 on: November 24, 2017, 03:01:08 AM »
Nope, not changing goals posts, simply being verbal on details of the holistic 'thing' that many do/did not understand or are missing the history of the CLOSED board list where some quotes and understanding comes from from posters to this post. Nothing new, just saying out loud now. Maybe I should post the board list on pastebin for other to have a better understanding.

Don't forget John, you speak out loud, and so do other (former) board members, on a public forum, referring to a closed list/forum/chat of board members. Nobody can verify what others are saying.

Regarding comment about POSSIBLE fraud, please consult with the state of Oregon in the US. I have been so kind to post the links to anyone started to realize what it takes to be a board and a board member.

AFAIK you are now defending YOUR period as president. I am not referring to that period, do I? I am referring to the CURRENT BOARD and 'president' bt that is obvious to any reader IF they had access to the closed board list.

And no, I will not retract any comment about any POSSIBLE fraud. It is possible for the board did and does not adhere to US - Oregon non profit rules. Hence me not taking any responsibility any longer as board member due to the lack of compliance by the president.

Offline DanB35

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #29 on: November 24, 2017, 04:16:37 AM »
Nobody can verify what others are saying.
Yes, a good number of people can.

Quote
It is possible for the board did and does not adhere to US - Oregon non profit rules.
It is possible that the sun will fail to rise tomorrow.  It is possible that you might be a Russian spy.  It is possible that I might be evil incarnate.  But since I have no evidence to support any of these possibilities, I don't give any significant thought to them.  Do you have any evidence to support your innuendo above?  And if so, why didn't you share it with the board before you resigned (again) a few weeks ago?
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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #30 on: November 24, 2017, 04:17:35 AM »
HSF,

You are completely out of control.   All of the Nonprofit filings and financial statements are right in the Google Docs repository for the project. 

I can tell you that you were not on the 2016 non-profit filing as a board member.  I'll get with JPP and see if he is OK for me posting it publicly, but it very clearly shows you aren't listed as a board member.  You quit and demanded to rejoin so often, I never included you after the very first filing.  It also shows the tax return for the foundation and also the PL statement.    I can tell you that Koozali rarely brings in more than $10,000-$13,000/year.  In 2016, the donations where $11,064.04. Bottom line is the donations don't amount to alot.    You know good and well these things were discussed during our video conference board meetings.   You never once raise any concern during these meetings.

If you look at the By-Laws for the Koozali Corporation, you never had any financial responsibility or authority as a director.  This responsibility is carried by the Officers of the Foundation:  "The President shall be the principal executive officer of the Corporation and shall in general supervise and control all of the business and affairs of the Corporation. "

I've never gotten a single email or message from you asking for anything.  All of this information is freely available on the Google Docs site for anyone on the board to see.  If you couldn't see something, all you had to do was ask and one of us could have made sure you could view it.

Feel free to contact whoever you want HSF.  There is no conspiracy.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2017, 05:01:26 AM by gzartman »
----
Greg J. Zartman
LEI Engineering & Surveying

SME user and community member since 2000.

Offline Jean-Philippe Pialasse

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Re: RequestedDeletion Nomination to 2017 Board
« Reply #31 on: November 24, 2017, 05:49:30 AM »
Reading the last comments of RequestedDeletion, he does not want to be nominated.
While this thread as become a fight, this is not related anymore with election.

I will just close this topic.

However, this should not discourage anyone raising to become member of the board as long as you are willing to be collaborative and to take responsibilities.
We have too few resources available to use them all on systematic confrontations. Yes, confrontations could occurs to stimulate innovation, but confrontations are not welcomed in this community if they seem to only be fights without purpose.