Topic: What [new] hardware for a small company?

[judgej]

The warranty is certainly a good point. Always useful to be able to offer options.

I've never set a system up yet that logs into an NT domain. Is this actually possible when a client uses a mix of Windows 98, XP Home and XP Pro? I got the impression it was only an NT/XP Pro thing, but I could be wrong. I suspect I'm missing out on some good stuff though.

My backups are probably going to be a mix of workstations and USB disk, with the workstations automated and the USB drive a manual thing (so they can control when they take a backup off-site).

-- JJ

[nmtrier]

I think that w98 could, but XP Home couldn't, so I have used persistent net shares to achieve similar effects. In this case, I made sure that the clients run XP Pro, so they can do the domain logon. Mixed workstations are not a problem as long as users don't expect the same environment wherever they logon!

[podge]

I got the machine that I am using as a server from http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Dell-Outlet late last year.

They have some great deal, but read carefully what you are buying.

I my case I picked up a OptiPlex 2.8GHz dual core with 1G memory and 80G hard drive for £220 (OS free) and that included 3 years next day on site warranty. For the sake of a small scratch on one side panel.

I run two SME severs on this using VMWare. (I have fitted a second disk and upped ram to 2G)

OK, this is a desktop machine not a server, but its a large form factor. And has coped so far with running 24/7. With near silent running for its huge fan.

Personally I would avoid small form factor machines, higher power density can lead to reliability problems.

Chilly

[Boris]

DELL Optiplex is a business class desktop and with exception of few models (G270 for example) they almost as reliable as entry level servers. Especially older models, that were build strong as tanks.
For noncritical tasks like small home server, I don't hesitate using them as well.

[andy_wismer]

Hi

Win98 / WinNT Login

I DO actually have clients running a SME as PDC and a mix of clients from Win98SE, WinNT, Win2000 and 2 WinXP Notebooks. They all log on to SME as PDC and have roving profiles and server based login scripts. Network drives are ONLY mapped with login script, I don't use UNC.


HP ML110 G4

I'm a big fan of the HP ML110 G4 series. I've got about 20 of 'em running SME at small/medium clients. I usually choose 2 SATA Disks 80 or 250 GB, depending on expected data volume, and an additional (third) SATA, also usually 250-500 GB, this one specifically for Backup2Disk in 5 or 7 generations.

I use an additional promise controller for the third disk, and mount it in a 5.25" bay - the ML110 G4 only supports 2 3.5" drives "out of the box". With the care-pack and additional RAM (512 is standard), you can get these boxes for quite a bargain price.

The big plus - they're really quiet. So quiet, that I got fed-up with my "built myself" server at home and replaced it with a new ML110. It runs SME (what else?) and VMWare, FireFly Media Server, Netjuke / Jinzora, SQL-Ledger and a few other things, but that server's basically my Home Music Server

UPS is mandatory for business servers, at home I don't have one (yet).

If I get the choice, it's HP-Compaq Proliant Servers

Andy Wismer

[azche24]

Hi,

HP ML110 G4
I'm a big fan of the HP ML110 G4 series. I've got about 20 of 'em running

I just sorted out a ML110G2: Loud as hell and a power-consumption > 150 Watt with 2 HDs. I hope, the G4 is better than that.

Seriously. I only use self-made AMD and Intel based servers for years now:
Big tower from chieftec, good power-supply from seasonic or enermax, good ram, at least 1 additional chassis-fan,  and mainboard like MSI 6368 with PIII/1000 CPU for homeserver and ASUS 8XN/XP1700 for an office-server with up to 8 users. Never any hardware related problem with that. And power consumption ranges from 50 - 90 watt.

[andy_wismer]

Hi

I've been building my own servers since 1997, but now I'd buy a Proliant.

I always chose "best of breed" components like 3Com / Intel NICs over Realtec or others. But still, over the last ten years, clients using Proliants gave me much less hardware headaches than those using my own built servers.

The HP G2 is MUCH louder - and bigger, too! The G2 is much "longer" than average PC's, the G4 is actually smaller than a normal Mini-Tower. The G2 also can hold 4 Disks, the G4 only 2.

The G4 is way better for "quieter" environments like office / home without a dedicated server-room.

One disadvantage of PCs is usually the small ventilators / fans "built-in".

Simple physics: A fan with half the diameter needs to run 4 times faster (!) to  keep up with the larger fan. This makes for more wear & tear, higher energy consumption (The fan motors get hot too...) and the worst part: dust and stuff like that usually kills the tiny 1" fans within a year.

My home server had hd-cartirdges, each with a small fan behind. I had to replace those things every few months, as they'ld just die and get hot...

With my HP ML110 G4, I'd just call HP

But then again, this thing doesn't have "tiny" fans - the big ones are WAY more reliable.

YMMV

Andy Wismer

[judgej]

What a great thread! Thanks to all who contributed.

I think we have two clear winners:

HP G4
Dell SC440

I'm going for an SC440 this time - only £190+VAT this month for the most basic 3GHz Pentium-D 512Mbyte configuration, inc. extra SATA HD, and with more than enough headroom to support a small business. I couldn't buy the bits and build myself for that price.

Just for comparison, I'll try the G4 next time

-- Jason

[k9]

Hi

I've just ordered a Dell Powedge T105 for my home office server.
Headline price is £99 incl Dual Core Opteron 1212, 2.0GHz, 2x1MB Cache, 2x 80GB HD, 512MB RAM, SATA DVD/CDRW combi.
My spec was Dual Core Opteron 1212, 2.0GHz, 2x1MB Cache,  2x 250GB HD, 512MB RAM (have 2GB spare at home), SATA DVD/CDRW combi.

Price incl delivery is £195.60 + VAT .. couldn't resist

Product code is PE1T1052, offer expires 25 Jan 08 or when 1000 units have been sold (max 2 per person).
UK only offer

Will be using latest SME + s/w RAID + extra 500GB SATA (from my stock) for backups

k

[judgej]

Jeeze - how can they possibly sell a complete server for less than it costs me to buy the processor alone?

[k9]

Yeah, great deal, should have bought 2 !

I've used the small optiron desktops in the past (2002-2004) but this is my first Dell server, thought it would be worth a go at the price.
I bought the desktops via europc and they worked very well even in a furniture factory ... tons of sawdust and general airbourne crap ... not good for PCs.  Used a DNUK rack server, with E-smith 3.x through to 5 (? was this the version number in early 2004?), software raided ... software raid saved our bacon on a number of occasions when the dust killed a hard drive. Dead easy to rebuild.

K

[judgej]

Yes, I believe 5.0 and 5.5 would have been around in 2004. I've been using it since 3.x too, when a [faulty] version was added to the cover disk of PC Plus. That must have been 2001 or thereabouts. Time really flys!

Thanks for the hardware tips - it really is helpful to know what's available on offer, as it can make a substantial difference to the overall costs. Perhaps we could do with a hardware forum, where people can simply post the hardware they use, experiences with that hardware, current special offers etc.

[k9]

Current home server is the missus' old PC, a winfast board, early AMD 64 processor (can't remember which), 512MB RAM 250GB HD, albeit in a small box, in a server cupboard.  Home servers have usually been ex desktops with Durons, Celerons etc .. software raided and/or rsync'd.

My furniture company had software raid and daily rsync'd via broadband to my home e-smith server. Logging in to work via VPN and/or SSH. E-Smith/SME is the bees knees, but clients take some convincing as they are used to Windows and having to log in/upgrade regularly to maintain it. A relatively non maintenance, low spec server that works, seems too good to be true to some clients! Most go for Win XX .

Will use new Dell server to backup my webservers and mirror my company data , also backed up to USB and remote storage ... paranoia or commercial reality ?

K
HRBSaccountants.com

[Peng]

Wow - perfect. Thanks I tried all the Dell tools to try and find those, but it always seemed to lead me to more expensive models. I guess it's similar to the leaflets we always seem to get through the door, offering fantasitic spec Dell laptops for £260, which you can never find on their site unless you type in the secret URL.

-- JJ

Actually, I'm not sure this is perfect, mainly because this product uses SATA hard drives whereas, according to the SME Server Admin Manual (Chapter 4), the minimum/recommended hard drives are IDE or SCSI.

--P

[mercyh]

Actually, I'm not sure this is perfect, mainly because this product uses SATA hard drives

There are many SME's running on SATA drives. Do we need to update the manual?

I am not sure if they still need to be jumpered down to 150/mbps transfer rate or not. (I did the last ones I built.)